deird_lj | Sympathy? Empathy? Apathy?

I am evol, because while I like all of these characters (except maybe Justine), I don't care about 'em all that much. Sort of like Angel, itself. More Drusilla is the only thing I felt really strongly about. *shrug*

I actually could've got into the Bai Ling character from "She", or demon guard Skip. (Not a girl, you say? Are you sure about that, say I.)

Really? I couldn't stand the woman from She. I snark my way through that episode, and fast-forward most of the stuff with her...

I second you on Bai Ling's Jhiera, even though it wasn't exactly a great episode!

*reads with interest8

*does not know even one single character mentioned*

Wasn't there a chick called Cordelia in this show? Or did you discount her because she was from BtVS?

*desperately desperately wants to know which answers Mez put*

*thinks about Mez' thought processes in compiling this poll*

In line with various fannish conversations we've had - would you expect people to, I don't know, all As, or or Bs, because people who LOVE one character always HATE a specific other character, etc, etc?

(no subject)

deird1 - 2009-10-24 10:04 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

ticketsonmyself.livejournal.com - 2009-10-25 21:53 (UTC) - Expand

Please note where I said the background characters. As in not the main ones. Cordelia is disqualified for being in the opening credits.

You've certainly seen a couple of them - at least in icon form. Darla is the blonde in the icon on this post *points up* and Lilah is in the icon on this comment.

(Briefly: Kate=cop, Justine=anti-vampire fighter gal, Gwen=sexy chick with electrical powers, Lilah=evil lawyer, Darla=vampire who made Angel a vampire.)

Ooh, and here are my answers (probably)...

Justine
- YOU HURT WESLEY, YOU BITCH. *gets an axe*
- Heh. Stuck with a bucket for months on end. *laughs and points*
Kate
- Dead father. Awww... *huggles her*
Gwen
- Sparky electrical fun! *cheers*
- *wolf-whistles*
Lilah
- Awesome lady of awesome. So very awesome.
- *dresses up as Lilah dressing up as Fred* Science turns me on. *fangirls that moment so hard*
- My answer is far too complex and interesting to be restrained by these puny options.
Darla
- I'm glad she killed herself because that moment was so WONDERFULLY tragic and sad and I ADORE it. *weeps copious tears*
- Come back to life again, Darla! We love you! Angel loves you too! *puppy dog eyes*

*uses another Lilah icon*

(no subject)

next_to_normal - 2009-10-24 14:40 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

deird1 - 2009-10-24 19:32 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

next_to_normal - 2009-10-24 21:46 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

angearia.livejournal.com - 2009-10-24 19:04 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

deird1 - 2009-10-24 19:33 (UTC) - Expand

Hmm. I find I just don't care about Justine. Which is ludicrous - she's tragic and vengeful and a big part of some plot points and... meh. It's not even the actress, who's very convincing. I just don't think her into my world, and I'd be surprised if I ever wrote fic about her.

Kate OTOH, I like but quite mildly. She had potential, and I liked an outsider perspective on Angel especially at the start when we're not quite sure how he's going to turn out in LA. But then she fizzled, and so did my interest.

Gwen is a bit ditto - she had potential, I like her episodes, I was very touched by her finally getting to touch. But I can't see her in s5, and I'm not sure how she would have fitted in. Short arc, nicely completed.

Lilah is fabulous (though oddly bad hair oddly often, which bugs me in someone so potentially stunning). Great villainess. I should have ticked bring back Lindsey too, because they're a great contrast in motivation and practice of evil-ness. Her Wesley relationship is THE most tortured and thrilling in AtS, though.

Darla I adore. Nuff said, except I don't want her to come back, as her arc went perfectly. She's not *nice*, nor good, even as a human. That would be the fun part, and why her death actually meant something.

Not sure there's a conclusion here, except that you and I are not that far apart!

(Hey! Icon twin!)

Yeah, I don't really care about Justine either - although I have written a drabble about her...

*agrees with you hugely, especially about Lilah and Darla*

I liked Justine and Holtz together. I kind of dug their twisted mentor/student hero-worship relationship, and they were both so ridiculously angry and vengeful. But they were in the show just enough, and I wasn't sad to see either of them go.

I liked Kate, too, but I didn't buy into her attempted suicide. After that, I thought her arc had run its course, and there was no need to bring her back (even if Elizabeth Rohm had been available).

Gwen was fun and hot, and I liked her. But again, she was just okay.

Lilah - Yay! I was sorry she wasn't in S5 instead of Eve. (Though I love Lindsay equally, and squeed when they brought him back.)

Darla - YAY! Out of all the female leads that they threw at Angel over the years, she was the only one that worked for me. Their chemistry was electric. And her death was absolutely perfect. *loves*

...I think I agree with everything you wrote here. :D

Justine: My main problem with Justine is that I thought the actress was terrible. I like the concept of the character just fine; it was the execution that fell flat. I have plans to write her into a story some day.

Kate: I really liked Kate until her daddy issues took over her whole character - and again, that's more a writing problem, because A) Everyone on the freaking show has daddy issues; can't someone have mommy issues, or uncle issues, or something? And B) Why does only the woman with daddy issues turn into an irrational bitch instead of being broody, tortured, yet noble?

Gwen: Again, not the best actress in the universe, but she was fun and had great chemistry with Gunn. I wish we'd seen more of her.

Lilah: Lilah had many Moments of Awesome. I loved Lilah in concept, the actress was fantastic... and the writers didn't know how to write a successful Evil Plan to save their lives, so Lilah, unfortunately, all too often came off as ineffectual and stupid rather than clever and dangerous.

I LOVE DARLA!!!!!!!!! DARLA COME HOME!!!!!!!

Nina: Another in the 'love the concept, iffy on the actress's ability to really bring it' side. In general I liked her and would have liked to have seen her more often.

Technically, Spike kinda has mummy issues...

and the writers didn't know how to write a successful Evil Plan to save their lives, so Lilah, unfortunately, all too often came off as ineffectual and stupid rather than clever and dangerous.

Agreed.

(no subject)

rahirah - 2009-10-24 23:36 (UTC) - Expand

re: Kate - I love Kate, but I agree that the show framed her as irrational rather than "broody, tortured, yet noble" and that it was totally a gendered/sexist thing.

I would've loved to see more Gwen and Nina, too. Love Darla, period!

True fact re: the writers' inability to formulate a solid Evil Plan and how that impacted Lilah!

I felt more resentment for Justine because she was so implacable and set on a course that was bound to hurt more people from the beginning. But I still had sympathy for her at the same time. :( She was used.

Love Kate, though. I'm glad I hadn't stumbled across online fandom when the show was on-air, because I would have been constantly raging about people disliking a useful, interesting, good secondary female character. (Yeah, Kate's definitely a litmus character for me. Someone can dislike her--fine. But if they start ranting about how awful she was, I seem to take it personally. Oh brain. So weird.)

I tend to like almost all female characters, though. Hm.

Yeah, Kate's definitely a litmus character for me. Someone can dislike her--fine. But if they start ranting about how awful she was, I seem to take it personally.

Same with me and Darla. :)

set on a course that was bound to hurt more people from the beginning. But I still had sympathy for her at the same time. :( She was used.

Agreed!

Love Kate, though. I'm glad I hadn't stumbled across online fandom when the show was on-air, because I would have been constantly raging about people disliking a useful, interesting, good secondary female character. (Yeah, Kate's definitely a litmus character for me. Someone can dislike her--fine. But if they start ranting about how awful she was, I seem to take it personally. Oh brain. So weird.)

Oh, I completely feel the same way about Kate! It's nice to find another Kate fan. :)

I really did like just about all the female characters on Angel! And considering how many recurring/main female characters there were, that actually surprised me when I first realized it - though I tend to be sympathetic to female characters in general.

Let's see -

Justine I'd probably have a more concrete opinion on once I get to her in my rewatch. Right now - eh. I feeel for her, but that doesn't necessarily mean she's an interesting character.

Kate is definitely growing on me, but she can be pretty tiresome.

Gwen just kicks ass. COME ON GUYS.

Lilah - HOW CAN PEOPLE NOT LOVE THIS WOMAN. SO. FUCKING. COOL.

(And all the people who wanted Lindsey back - wuhbuh? Hate that man.)

Darla...oh, Darla...

I like her, but I hate the sheer amount of time Angel spends whining/going crazy over her. And the whole pregnancy thing got a little weird. But her killing herself was sad.

I liked Lindsey in the evil hand episode - but that's really about all. Mostly he's kinda boring.

GWEN IS SO AWESOME.

(no subject)

lavastar.livejournal.com - 2009-10-25 00:52 (UTC) - Expand

Your poll lacked the option to tick for Justine to say that she's an awesome, violent, scary and totally hot redhead who thinks she's a Slayer and is also awesome. And tragic.

Lilah was much more fun when she had Lindsey to ~~spark~~ snark off.

Also? *points to icon*

I actually preferred Lilah snarking at Gavin. *is weird that way*

Your poll lacked the option to tick for Justine to say that she's an awesome, violent, scary and totally hot redhead who thinks she's a Slayer and is also awesome. And tragic.

Heh. It honestly didn't even occur to me as a perspective.

(I forgot Nina! *facepalm* I can't believe I forgot her!)

(no subject)

penny-lane-42.livejournal.com - 2009-10-24 22:44 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

lavastar.livejournal.com - 2009-10-25 00:52 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

deird1 - 2009-10-25 01:17 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

ticketsonmyself.livejournal.com - 2009-10-25 22:11 (UTC) - Expand

(no subject)

ticketsonmyself.livejournal.com - 2009-10-25 22:10 (UTC) - Expand

I like your ticky boxes because they allow me to pick lots of contradictory things! Yay!

I didn't vote in the Justine and Kate categories, because...I don't remember, really, enough to have a good opinion. I've only watched Angel once--well, I've watched a lot of the S5 episodes many times, and a few other scattered ones here and there. I feel that my opinion might change. I remember finding Kate smug and annoying, and other than a few jaw-dropping moments with Justine (the CLOSET? SERIOUSLY, WES?), she was a bit of a non-entity to me. I'd have to revisit.

I had an instant girlcrush on Gwen, though, because she's pretty and can shoot people with electricity! Also, she appreciated Gunn. *loves Gunn*

But my love for both Lilah and Darla was unending. I voted for all the positive things on both of those. And also for more Drusilla and more Lindsey. Because I wanted more of both of them.

My feelings are clearly not complex or interesting. *sigh*

*loves ticky boxes*

*loves Lilah*

*loves Darla*

*loves comments this long*

I hated everything about Kate as a character, but that had nothing to do with her being blond. I voted that one anyway though, since it's the closest to how I feel about her, lol. I was really glad when she left the show, and I almost never made it past the first season because she grated on me so badly.

I love love love Darla, Lilah, and I am pretty fond of Gwen, though I don't really care about her that much as a character (probably mostly due to the less time spent on her).

Justine...she is more complicated. I hate that she hurts Wesley. I HATE it so much! Because Wesley is like, my favorite character in the world ever. But you know another one of my favorite characters? Faith. And she hurt Wesley too. Justine and Faith are very similar, actually. They both want to belong to something, but they don't understand the big picture. While I am not going to sit and cry for Justine (because there is a level of pathetic there, to be sure) I think she is a slightly tragic figure.

To me, Kate is like the female Ballard (from Dollhouse). It's the whole self-riotous, single-minded thing. I just hate watching them. Also, the whole "Daddy, why didn't you love me enough!?" gets real old.

To me, Kate is like the female Ballard (from Dollhouse). It's the whole self-riotous, single-minded thing.

Ooh, good point. I really hadn't made that comparison...

The first two--don't really care enough to add more.

Gwen--I thought she would have made a great companion for Angel. And she was snarky and fun and...why didn't they bring her back?

Lilah--one bad bitch. Even when she was evil, you couldn't help but adore her. I can't put it into words just yet, and I'm not doing her justice, but I'll probably write about it. But yeah, she's a total bitch, and I <3 her so. *see icon--bitches are awesome*

Darla--same thing. Darla is just... *fangirls over Darla* I can't complain too much about her final ending, because it was SO AMAZING, and bringing her back may have cheapened it...but yeah, she's effin' fabulous.

Lilah really is awesome...

Kate is one of my favourites in the entire show. I do think they floundered with her character in season two, and I understood Angel being weary and irritated with it all, but I always sympathised with her. (I also shipped her with Angel hardcore, but considering how they handled Cordy/Angel...it's probably best they didn't go there.) I wish she'd at least been mentioned after leaving, so we knew she wasn't dead in a ditch somewhere or something.

Justine was just kinda there. I don't know why, I was just never engaged with her, despite the fact that I usually like that character type, or at least care about them.

Gwen was fun, Lilah kicked progressively more ass as time went on, and Darla is probably my second favourite Fanged Four family member. (First being Angel himself.) Though I'm STILL not sure how "I have a baby and his soul is affecting me" works.

I also shipped her with Angel hardcore, but considering how they handled Cordy/Angel...it's probably best they didn't go there.

Definitely.